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banneryear1868 ,

You can see this all the time with Hollywood liberal values. All the gay stereotyping and jokes through the 90s then all of a sudden they're patting themselves on the back for being the arbiters of social progress.

WarmApplePieShrek ,

What is opposing a war?

People call themselves war opponents when they oppose invading Vietnam, which is good.

People also call themselves war opponents when they oppose Ukraine defending itself, which is bad. They support Russia invading Ukraine. They support wars except the ones when the US is invading.

avrachan ,

nobody opposes to Ukraine defending itself.

Anti-War stance involves opposing Russia for invading Ukraine along with blood thirsty neoliberals like Victoria nuland who will sacrifice Ukrainian people to advance US strategic interest. They want this war to go on as long as they can make it go on. no price is too small.

DragonTypeWyvern ,

No one buys what you're selling. Russia can end the war today, but they won't, because they're run by a literally evil kleptocratic dictator.

DarkGamer ,
@DarkGamer@kbin.social avatar

It's almost like one must examine and consider each conflict individually.

BaroqueInMind ,
@BaroqueInMind@kbin.social avatar

I'm liberal and support trans/gay rights, woman's body autonomy, social umbrellas for the poor and unhoused, legalization of recreational drugs, but I also like guns and desire all minorities who have no agency to own them, as well as support all wars against bullies because pacifism does nothing to stop them otherwise. Where do I stand? I guess I'll go fuck myself then.

underisk ,
@underisk@lemmy.ml avatar

I think that makes you a leftist who hasn’t yet realized that liberalism doesn’t want many of those things.

BaroqueInMind ,
@BaroqueInMind@kbin.social avatar

Sounds like liberalism can go fuck itself too if they don't care about trans/gay rights, etc.

underisk ,
@underisk@lemmy.ml avatar

They care about them in a performative way. The minute it stands in their way or they can’t use it as a tool to get your support to gain or maintain power they will immediately drop the act. Before Oberfell even Obama wouldn’t give a clear statement of support for gay marriage because it was seen as political poison.

bdonvr ,

social umbrellas

Treat the symptoms not the cause

support all wars against bullies because pacifism does nothing to stop them otherwise.

Simplify geopolitics into "bullies", support the actions of NATO/US as though they're not "bullies"

Pretty much liberal yeah

lingh0e ,

Treat the symptoms not the cause.

You'll find that almost all liberals also want to treat the cause, but they are blocked at every step by conservatives and centrists.

Shialac ,

But why do they defend the core underlying cancer - capitalism?

nixcamic ,

Treat the symptoms not the cause

Treat both. They usually give you a painkiller while setting your bones.

oatscoop ,
@oatscoop@midwest.social avatar

Wait until they find out that there's a ton of "we don't know what the underlying cause is" and "we don't have a cure for that yet" in medicine. In which case you have to do your best treating the symptoms -- which is also true outside of the world of medicine.

Sometimes a temporary fix buys you time to do it right. Sometimes a perfect or even "really good" solution isn't feasible for myriad reasons: so you do the best with what you have.

nixcamic ,

It's just such a stupid false dichotomy. Give the man the fish and teach him to fish. It's a lot easier to learn on a full stomach.

MajinBlayze ,

That's the fun thing; go far enough left and find that guns become an important tool for the proletariat to protect itself from the ruling class.

banneryear1868 ,

Those are all very liberal-minded interests and there's nothing really wrong with them. The left largely agrees as well but would go further to the structural causes for why these issues are important, questioning the very economic and material arrangements for which these issues are contingent on. IE why does our economic system require people to be poor? What are the class dynamics behind these issues etc.

Liberalism is the ideology of free markets and individual freedom, but those mechanisms are contingent on exploitation.

WarmApplePieShrek ,

You are left.

BirdyBoogleBop ,

Need to know his stsnce on capitalism first.

Varyk ,

Is this a "the right can't meme" thing? Liberals are opposed to the current Russia-ukraine war and Israeli-palestine war and are currently supporting the newest civil rights movement.

Vespair ,

Nah I think it's just the same snake-in-the-grass right wing propaganda bullshit that infects every leftist space online to sow complacency and disempower us with apathy by trying to convince us that the comparative left-ish-leaning party is the same or worse than the right so as to maintain the hold on power the right has. It's bullshit anti-leftist wolf-in-sheep's-clothing rhetoric. Same as it always was.

Edit: typos.

ElcaineVolta ,
@ElcaineVolta@kbin.social avatar

I don't know OP, or the OOP, but I read this as criticizing liberals from the left which is something many leftists engage in all the time, I know I do

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