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Do you think people would be okay with 'Recall' if Apple did it?

With the recent WWDC apple made some bold claims about privacy when it comes to so called Apple Intelligence. This makes me wonder if they did something to what Microsoft did with Recall feature, would people be less concerned and to an extend praise their effort?

Do you trust apple with their claims?

BeigeAgenda ,
@BeigeAgenda@lemmy.ca avatar

I'm not sure I would use a open source Linux version of Recall, I think it would be like always sharing/streaming your desktop, so I think .bash_history is enough recall for me.

I would also allow an open source version of Co-Pilot because the AI snooping only happens within a single program.

mojoaar ,
@mojoaar@lemmy.world avatar

Don't care if it's Apple, M$ or Google - non of them should do it that way.

M500 ,

I completely agree. I’ve started to migrate my work stuff to Linux to see if it will work.

I’m not hopeful that it will work, but the dev said I can try to use wine and that is not against their policy to do so and that I works but have to worry about an account ban.

So, let’s hope for the best.

Macaroni_ninja ,
@Macaroni_ninja@lemmy.world avatar

In my opinion the problem is not who would agree/disagree with it, its more like the fanbase and marketing is on another level and most people would just not care as long as they have the latest iPhone with the latest buzzword functions and features.

I feel people are more forgiving towards apple. I dont have any study or anything to back it up, just can't see why the die-hard userbase of the most isolated and curated ecosystem would care about anything.

some_guy ,

No. The whole world turned against them in 2021 (I think?) when they were gonna have on-device monitoring for CSAM. They'd get run over by a bus for this too, same as MS.

becausechemistry ,

It was a scan during upload to their cloud photos system. Everyone else does it on their servers, Apple was going to run the scan before so they didn’t have to ever have them. To not have images scanned before upload, a user would just not have to use their cloud photos service.

The messaging was really badly handled. They almost certainly just scan all the same photos on their servers instead now.

Natanael ,

The perceptual hash algorithm was broken in hours, then so fully broken that modified images were visually indistinguishable from unmodified images, so you could send people images with hash values that match flagged photos.

Also, then there's the thing of the risk of various jurisdictions pushing for adding detection of other banned content.

shortwavesurfer ,

No

umbrella , (edited )
@umbrella@lemmy.ml avatar

yes lol. have you ever talked to apple fanboys? its a cult where the corporation can't possibly be wrong.

they would justify with flimsy justifications and hold their ground that its actually the best use of ai just yet.

Fungah ,

People.would be okay by getting fucked to death with a splintery rake if apple charged $999.99 for it.

ssm ,
@ssm@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

You're saying this like Micro$hit isn't just going to revert back to recall being opt-out (or non-removable) in a few weeks after the outrage dies down

SoulKaribou ,

You got me at trust

macabrett ,

I think the people who already really like Apple would be okay with it and find a million reasons to justify it. I don't think that's a good thing.

HubertManne ,

apple fanboys. yes. the take it or leave it apple types would likely have a decent exodus. non apple users would not like but would not matter.

pound_heap ,

Apple's PR is better.
With Microsoft all news titles were like "OMG Windows will take screenshots of all you do and send it to AI", and with Apple it's more like "Apple is carefully adding AI to their products, respecting user privacy as they always have been".

Of course, when one looks into technical details they would find that MS Recall is strictly local and runs only on special hardware that people don't even have yet.

Apple Intelligence does send your data to cloud and scans everything you have in Apple ecosystem, not just screenshots. Of course they say it's done in very privacy respecting ways, and provide a lot of technical information to back this claim. But at the end it's closed source and is subject to change at any time.

Having said that, Apple users are used to and value that Apple magically takes care of everything, so they are happy to pay premium for Apple's products whatever the company does.

NGC2346 ,

Makes a lot of sense until the closed source affirmation. The source code of the OS they develop is closed source, but a lot of what they do is open source and independantly audited by experts, so there's that in the balance.

Windows is just a pile of trash.

jjlinux ,

What that Apple does is Open Source? This is the first time I've read this.

NGC2346 ,

Swift,
Webkit,
Researchkit,
Carekit,
FoundationDB,
CUPS,
Darwin,
LLVM and Clang,
SwiftNIO,
Turi Create,
Homekit ADK,

Its one thing to be against a product but its essential to be well informed and not base our perceptions on biased informations.

jjlinux ,

Yup, that's why I asked. I still hate Crapple and everything they stand for, but this is good data to start doing some in-depth research. Thanks.

Quique ,

Damn hating a product. You are damaged man.

jjlinux ,

Who says I am a man? Just kidding, I am. I do hate Apple, Google, Microsoft, Meta and every other company out there that operate business on a predatory model. Am I damaged? Absolutely, at so many levels it's hard to count them. But that makes me just human, as you will find there is not 1 single human out there that is not damaged at some or other. On the brighter side, I am doing what I can to heal.

wuphysics87 ,

I'm not familiar with all of them, but I know several of them are tools. Isn't it in apple's best interest to open source the tools if people use and improve them, and subsequently it means they get more money from the app store? And if these are the only things they open source, they still have a tight fist on the vast majority of their code base.

While on the subject of apple and FOSS. They may open source some tools, but do they give back to other projects? I.e. does apple push upstream? Substantially less than google and ms. And I would go so far to say almost never.

NGC2346 ,

You're diverging from the main subject from what is open source to what you find acceptable behaviour from a corporation, which i do not involve in.

matthewc ,

Darwin. Their BSD and the foundation of MacOS and therefore all the current OSes they produce.

jjlinux ,

I have heard of Darwin, and went back to read up on it to refresh my memory. While it is considered open source, it is also useless unless it is used for Apple's closed source operating systems, as can be appreciated in this explanation:

In the beginning, Apple used to make Darwin available as a separate OS, including compiled binaries, installers, ISOs, etc. that you could install on Apple hardware. However, for many years now, Apple only provides a source code dump, every time a new release of macOS comes out. It isn't even possible to compile this source code, because it depends on Apple's internal build tools and build pipeline. There have been some projects trying to patch Darwin to compile it with publicly available tools, but those projects have all died from lack of interest.

Open Source should be compilable and able to be used, at least that's my perspective, and I just may be wrong.

Here's the article this came from on StackExchange:

https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/401832/why-is-macos-often-referred-to-as-darwin

jonne ,

Yeah, but that's just the kernel. Anything above that (window manager, the utilities that they didn't outright copy from BSD, apps, ...) is basically closed source.

matthewc ,

Yes

pound_heap ,

I guess there is a chance to see some of code, but I doubt about it being properly open sourced.

While we’re publishing the binary images of every production PCC build, to further aid research we will periodically also publish a subset of the security-critical PCC source code.

Source: https://security.apple.com/blog/private-cloud-compute/

abuttandahalf ,

As far as we know, apple's system does not take screenshots automatically, storing them unencrypted, likely revealing secrets to other programs.

jose1324 ,

Recall doesn't either.. it's encrypted with Windows Hello Auth

Natanael ,

But once a process is running its trivial to get weeks of extremely detailed history and lots of secrets you thought were ephemeral

0x2d ,

https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/19119cdc-d15a-4de3-97a5-92564eadf0c8.jpeg

xylazineDream ,
@xylazineDream@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

They already did, Spotlight is Machiavelli behind the “walled garden”

arxdat ,
@arxdat@lemmy.ml avatar

Apple at least tries to explain what is happening, and while not always great, you feel you understand why they are doing something or implementing new functionality unlike Windows who just dumps this shit on you without your consent and then you have to learn 5 years later that they put absolutely no thought in why they were doing, especially thinking about your privacy. Anyway, I use Arch, btw. /s

pumpkinseedoil ,

Could they please explain why a laptop should not be able to scale content on third party monitors without lowering resolution? Why it shouldn't be able to connect to more than one monitor? Why we can't have a toggle for (insert random unneeded feature here, like only minimizing programs when clicking on the red x button that should close them). Why their tablets and phones aren't able to send things via Bluetooth? Etc.

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