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victorz , to Technology in Estonia | The Digital State

It scares me, honestly. The level of security for this to be viable is insane. Imagine some flaw or accident or attack that would erase me as a citizen. Scary thought.

BrianTheeBiscuiteer ,

This is one place where blockchain is actually useful. No one entity is responsible for the integrity of the "ledger". Of course it wouldn't be publicly writable so not exactly like the blockchains you normally think of.

UraniumBlazer OP ,

I can't see how the blockchain would be particularly useful here either. The security features of the blockchain come at the cost of extreme energy usage. Storing documents using simple public-private key cryptography is waaaay more than enough imo.

BrianTheeBiscuiteer ,

You don't have to "mine blocks" to have a blockchain. It's just a continual list of transactions that can't be modified after the fact. So a hacker couldn't wipe out your existence from the chain without controlling the majority of the participants (in a consensus algorithm). Not saying it's an ideal use-case but highlighting that feature. There are many ways to avoid "data wipe" attacks.

lud ,

So they are immutable basically.

UraniumBlazer OP ,

It wouldn't really affect u even if ur id got deleted. Let me explain. Ur id is nothing but information correct (your name, address, etc.). The same goes with contracts. What makes ur id special is that the government has verified it to be legit.

A very simple way of doing this is by making the government cryptographically sign ur id/contact. I would really recommend getting a functional understanding of how public-private key cryptography works. Basically, the government just has to put up its public key online. If u have ur id, u can verify if the document is issued by the government using their public key.

As long as the public key stays there, and u don't lose ur id and contracts they won't technically be lost.

Also, if the public key suddenly changes/disappears without being notice, everyone would know that something's up. It's like ur government building's staff was suddenly replaced.

victorz ,

I would really recommend getting a functional understanding of how public-private key cryptography works.

I have an intermediate understanding of how it works. 👍

and u don't lose ur id and contracts

Ah, yeah... Therein might lie an issue. 😅

UraniumBlazer OP ,

Ah, yeah... Therein might lie an issue. 😅

But that's an issue with papered systems as well, no?

rottingleaf ,

For most people not so scary until the one snafu to rule them all.

Hence it exists.

Can you change that people are stupid and find new and new ways to ruin their own lives? If you can't, just look and enjoy.

victorz ,

It's just that I don't want my own country to get any wild ideas. I mean, the ideal digital society utopia is an amazing thought experiment. But it feels very fragile for us at this time. We are still in our technological infancy as a species, even if we feel very advanced.

ricdeh , to Technology in Estonia | The Digital State
@ricdeh@lemmy.world avatar

As long as this digital infrastructure is developed by the administration itself, I find the idea of a digital bureaucracy great. But relying on proprietary products would undermine its purpose, imho.

asdfasdfasdf ,

Should be open sourced to. Auditing is crucial.

JayDee , to Technology in Estonia | The Digital State

One thing I commonly hear as an argument against electronic voting is security and ease of vote tampering. Is Estonia solving this issue and, if so, how?

huginn ,

Idk if you watched the video but the reason it works is mentioned in the video, if not explored in detail.

You have a digital id and a digital signature that is tied to you as a citizen.

Each vote has to be signed with your personal voter signature.

JayDee ,

I watched though about half of it, before concluding that this video is only going to be a summary video that won't answer my questions fully.

Digital ID and Digital signature are absolutely necessary, though depending on how those two are implemented I could still see fraud and vote manipulation being feasible. I was hoping someone with more knowledge about how Estonia is doing its security and verification systems to ensure records aren't being modified maliciously.

sandalbucket ,

I’m happy to revisit and explain, but I don’t have much time to type right now - the wikipedia page for estonia has great info; you will need a basic understanding of cryptographic hashing and merkle trees

CucumberFetish ,

There should also be a 30sth page doc about how the e-voting machines are set up, configured and secured somewhere. But it is in Estonian and I can't be arsed to find it now

CucumberFetish ,

Everyone in Estonia has to have an ID card, which contains the RSA keys and x.509 certs for giving digital signatures.

huginn ,

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estonian_identity_card

It's actually fascinating. Asymmetric keys with public keys hosted by the government and the private key in your ID.

A 4 digit pin1 code is required to use the authorization key and a 5 digit pin2 is required to use the signing key.

The average Estonian signs 50 documents per year using this method.

admin ,
@admin@lemmy.my-box.dev avatar

Regarding electronic voting, you can either have reliable and secure, or anonymous, but not both. Sounds like Estonia went for option 1.

stepan , to Fuck Cars in The Disturbing Death Disparity on North American Roads

SUVs, pitbulls, guns, sugary food

Freedumb

cordlesslamp , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper

Why his eyebrows (the Rabbit guy) look so fake? Is he wearing makeup?

jjjalljs , to Privacy in De-Google Your Life - Part 1 - YouTube LTT

I want to get off Google photos, but I also don't want to pay a subscription. And I don't really want to self host. A pay once service I'd accept, but I haven't seen one with an extremely cursory search. I don't need any fancy features. Just store the photos, let me see them online, and let me put them in albums.

Bruhh ,

If its free, then you are the product. Can't really expect to switch to another free product and expect any form of privacy. You could try Microsoft's One Drive but it isn't much different. I've been recommending Ente Photos which is a subscription but it's worth it for me. About 3 or 4 bucks a month for 50GB.

jjjalljs ,

If its free, then you are the product

Right. I get that. But I'd like to just pay once. I don't like subscriptions. But since file storage has ongoing costs, it seems unlikely anyone would offer a pay-once-and-we'll-host-your-files.

Bruhh ,

There is pcloud and filen.io both have lifetime plans but I'm not sure how close you can get to something like Google Photos or Ente Photos with these providers.

possiblylinux127 OP ,
@possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip avatar

Hosting pictures cost money

HeartyOfGlass , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper

"Fraud" is the correct term here.

ResoluteCatnap , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper

What else do you expect from a company that first started with NFTs?

of course they are going to scam and gaslight you

dinckelman ,

They clearly don’t want you to know that, granted that they’ve conveniently renamed their company, and announced they don’t want anything to do with crypto, right before the Rabbit announcement went live

toastal , to Privacy in De-Google Your Life - Part 1 - YouTube LTT

Google services I still use before being unGoogled:

  1. Voice: I have to make like 1 or 2 calls within the US a year & not worth a SIM
  2. Maps: for when OSM isn’t cutting it & I’ll contribute the missing data after I found it
  3. Translate: for when Yandex Translate doesn’t cut it (everything ‘free’ only works with European languages)
  4. YouTube: no real alternative here that isn’t limited to just a piece of its scope, but viewed thru Librewolf+uBlock Origin+SponsorBlock or PipePipe

… and the last one is just basically every employer I have worked with puts all their company data on Google & it can’t really be avoided with them >:(

Allero ,

Can't help but mention Yandex is 100% as evil as Google is.

Out of popular choices, DeepL is probably least evil. Reverso is often a nice pick, too, especially Reverso Context.

There are also things like LibreTranslate, though the quality is generally lower (but can absolutely come in handy for simpler requests)

possiblylinux127 OP ,
@possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip avatar

You also can use a LLM model

Allero ,

A local open-source one, preferably.

toastal ,

Yandex might be the same as Google, but spreading your footprint across services still has value as a technique for mitigation. The only other thing I use Yandex for is the occasional image search since it can sometimes do a better job than others.

Allero ,

Fair enough; however, to me it's only optimal when there are no alternatives.

But to each their own.

Zerush , (edited )
@Zerush@lemmy.ml avatar

Not relly true, eg YT, there are still several scripts to gut out ads, tracks and nags from YT (take a look in Greasyfork or OpenuserJS) (for YT naturally filter the newest and recent updated scripts), if one of the front-ends dont work.

Well, OSM and forks or Here maps don't have the features of Gmaps (eg Street view) but are way enough for the most use.

For translations, OpenSource isn't sinonimo of bad, eg, CrowTranslate for Desktop or the Linguist extension for the browser are FOSS and maybe the best you can find out there, multiengines for more than 120 lenguages, they use the APIs of Google, Yandex and others (customizable, Linguist use also the Bergamot Translator(At the moment still in developement and only EU languages, but they'll add more soon)), similar to the front-ends for YT, so Google isn't a problem.

Yes, naturally if you are an Google user for your work, few you can do, but there are alternatives to use Google only the minimum needed.

toastal ,

A YouTube alternative client doesn’t change that all of the infrastructure is Google’s. Even this video shows you need YouTube to reach the audience you want for this style of content.

I hadn’t heard of new translators options in the last two years, but only Lingva listed the two non-English languages I actually use. The rest are all European-based languages. I may have some time to check it out, but it looked like quite a bit of tooling to set up.

Zerush ,
@Zerush@lemmy.ml avatar

Both translators mencioned, Crow and Linguist are full customizable with cusom translators, Crow include, among others, also Lingva by default nd both can traduce more than 120 lenguages, depending on which engine you activate, posting even in Sanscrit if you want

Highsight , to Privacy in De-Google Your Life - Part 1 - YouTube LTT
@Highsight@lemmy.world avatar

I used AI to summarize the different Google products and services listed in the video along with their suggested alternatives and timestamps. AI is pretty cool sometimes.

Google Product/Service Recommended Alternatives Timestamp
Google Chrome Firefox, Brave, Arc, Ungoogled Chromium 94-326
Google Search Startpage, Ecosia, DuckDuckGo, Brave Search, Kagi 328-493
Gmail Tutanota, ProtonMail 534-671
Google Photos Ente, Stingle 674-794
Google DNS Quad9, NextDNS, Cloudflare 827-1074
Google Analytics Not covered in this video, to be discussed in part 2 N/A
Google Maps To be covered in part 2 N/A
Google Ad Services To be covered in part 2 N/A
Google Drive To be covered in part 2 N/A
YouTube To be covered in part 2 N/A
kate , to Privacy in De-Google Your Life - Part 1 - YouTube LTT

Brave has an openly homophobic founder, it’s weird to me that they’d mention the crypto issues and not this

okrakai ,

who cares

ondoyant ,
@ondoyant@beehaw.org avatar

plenty of people?

jol ,

And Microsoft has a habit of interfering with democracies and bribing governments. Let's not pretend any big tech is a saint. The difference between dumb billionaires like Eich and Musk and others is that they have bad PR.

kate ,

I don’t like Microsoft either and I’m not sure the relevance of you bringing this up, is this trolling?

jol ,

It's not trolling. Eich is a scumbag but if you ditch Brave, right now your only real options and Microsoft Bing and Google. And I think MS and Google do way more bad to the world than Eich. How many MS nd Google executives do you think are right wingers donating to anti gay groups? Definitely not zero.

kate ,

I disagree that those are the only options, even in the video we are commenting on they name some others

Zerush ,
@Zerush@lemmy.ml avatar

Yes, I did it oftn. But main reason to avoid Brave is the somewhat fishy Crypto Policy and the betrayal of users in the past, redirecting searches to related crypto companies, which shows dubious business ethics regarding the user. For me Brave is simply not trustworth.

Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In ,

Much better reasons than insinuating a piece of software is homophobic.

Zerush ,
@Zerush@lemmy.ml avatar

Homophobic the CEO Eich, but for the user it's more important the ethics of the company, questionable in Brave.

Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In ,

Yes. I'm agreeing.

EngineerGaming ,
@EngineerGaming@feddit.nl avatar

My main issue with it is the fact that the company has shown it is willing to cross boundaries.

Defaced , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper

The scammer even looks high AF every time he does an interview. This guy is a fucking joke.

dogma11 ,

Not sure I agree with high AF, but definitely sounds like he's lying or making up bullshit all the time

maxenmajs , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper
@maxenmajs@lemmy.world avatar

Clueless investors will never stop enabling obvious tech start-up scams.

Duamerthrax ,

It's gambling. They're gambling addicts. They all want to be on ground zero for the next Google or Amazon.

silasmariner ,

Sounds like a mnemonic for something

paraphrand , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper

BUT THE LAM! People reported on the “large action model” like it was real. It always sounded like bullshit, in this case. Even if they were selling ideas they feel are obvious and inevitable.

Imgonnatrythis ,

I dunno. It sounds like a somewhat feasible thing that could be kinda useful if done right. It just doesn't actually exist which is the problem here. It doesn't sound too crazy which is why people bought this thing. The part I struggle with conceptually is that LAM would essentially weaponize bots - the same thing all these stupid captchas are meant to stop. Also it would drive users away from websites and therefore away from ads. This would be all out war and the money (I. E. Websites with ad revenue) would ultimately win unfortunately.

paraphrand ,

I agree that it’s logical to do.

And here we are now with Microsoft’s rewind thing. And rumors about Apple giving Siri the ability to see your screen visually.

It actually seems inevitable. But Rabbit was spinning tales.

SteefLem , to Technology in Rabbit Gaslit Me, So I Dug Deeper
@SteefLem@lemmy.world avatar

Artificial, yes. Intelligent, no.

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