It's not even limited to smart cars though. Yes used does let you a oid it, but it's not like this is just people buying the fancy trims either. Shit like this is working it's way down to the run of the mill standard cars year after year.
I have a college education and a well paying job the monthly payment on a new car has doubled since I bought my last one in 2020. No way am I buying a new car at these prices/rates.
That's great, but the question from that OP was "are you able to" and your answer should be yes. I make less than that and I definitely am able to. But I'm waiting on the market to correct first
Though it also depends on how you define "able to". Like I could fit a car payment in my budget but it would eat up most of my disposable income and I'm not willing to give that up, even if new cars weren't so enshitified. I bet there's a lot in this "technically capable but it would be a stupid financial move" group.
Buying a new car never really made sense to me even when you could afford it. 2 - 3 year old model is effectively brand new but a lot cheaper. Why pay more if you can pay less?
2 - 3 year old model is effectively brand new but a lot cheaper.
I've always heard this, but where is this actually true? When I bought a Camry like a decade ago, I could get a brand new one for $19.5k or used ones with 50k miles on them for....$18k. so yeah I paid the extra 1.5k to not have to deal with potential random shit.
When my wife bought her car a few years ago it was a similar situation. The only used cars that were "a lot cheaper" had like 100k miles.
It made sense to me when I could take advantage of a tax credit for EVs in 2017. Now that car companies/dealerships simply jack up prices to eat that discount, it doesn't make sense even in that case.
Remember when gov't banned Furbies (sp?) in some places? Seems like they would make the same decision for a lot of people in important positions regarding their car purchasing.
I don't think I'm going to ever buy a car made after 2020. Maybe earlier. None of the new features really appeal to me, and there are a lot of things like this that actively turn me off from wanting a new car.
If they could just give me an electric version of a 1985 VW Golf I'd be happy as a clam. But they want to put me in some lumpy, heavy, clumsy CUV with tracking technology and all the touchscreens and I don't like it.
EV conversions are definitely a thing. And the Golf platform seems to actually be one of the most popular.
After a quick Google, it looks like there are even some premade kits for the Golf specifically, even with installation available. Although I can only find UK/EU links quickly. May be more built-it yourself in the US.
I'm missing something. How is the data actually collected? How does it get out of my car? My car doesn't have any cellular features other than CarPlay. It has wifi, but I've never used it.
It seems a lot of the new ones have a cellular modem. On the surface it's to let you remotely access the car or do a remote start. Even if you don't pay to subscribe and use it for your purposes they can utilize it to transfer out the data.
Cellular is usually how the vehicle provides Wi-Fi, it is effectively just a cell hotspot like you would get from a ohone carrier, but tied into the vehicle. So I think that would be the common way they get the data out.
My point is people shouldn't need to try to outsmart the car manufacturer for basic privacy rights. If you don't fully control something you don't own something.
Imagine if they remotely bricked a bunch of vehicles. (Ransomware maybe?) You would be powerless to stop them and out of luck. I'm sure there would be a lawsuit but you still would be without a car.
Disconnecting the antenna is probably not a bad idea but the problem is cars have become black box computers so you never know where there could be a weakness. For all you know it might be possible to crash the car systems via Bluetooth.
What I want is some user freedom laws plus some DMCA exceptions for consumers looking to escape vendor lock in. Privacy protections would also be nice but being able to change and examine software would be a step in the right direction.
The hero photo for the article shows a camera over a road that likely is likely running number plate recognition software...
Honestly I'd be more worried about where that data is going than the tracking software in your car. They've got the most critical information (where did you drive and when), and they've got it for every car instead of just Honda drivers.
This needs to be fixed with legislation, and it needs to be fixed actively. For example by getting rid of number plates entirely and replacing them with something like the transponders used in aircrafts and ships, but with an encrypted rolling code that only shares your data when authorised to do so (by the owner of the vehicle).
Apple "Find My" works like that... your location is encrypted, and it's uploaded without any identifying information. When the user brings up a map looking for their keys, that's the only time encryption keys are handed over allowing the already stored information to be accessed. The car version of that could be police asking you at every traffic stop to hit a button on your dashboard that unlocks your registration/insurance details so they can run a quick check against their outstanding warrant/etc database.
Imo, the only solution is every device with an antenna must be legally required to put a manual off switch.
Cell service, wifi, Bluetooth, any future service. If it broadcasts it needs a physical off switch.
If I sold my car to a government official and they found out I had hidden a camera, microphone and GPS in the car, I'd get a visit from the FBI. Yet companies do it with impunity. Does the CEO of Subaru have recordings of Bernie Sanders driving in his car?
I'm not that nostalgic. Everything about my new car is better than my older cars. My 2023 minivan has a better 0-60 than my old V-8 Mustang while getting 2x the MPG. The only thing that is bad is the tracking.
They sure don’t, cars continue to be safer, more durable, and require less service every model year. The median age of the automobiles on the road gets older every year.
The current generation of the ford mustang Mach-e has its mobile telemetry cellular antenna wired to an isolated fuse that you can just pull out to kill it. I was astonished to learn how straight forward the process is supposed to be.
And each type of communication needs it's own switch. Don't let them pull some BS trying to make you enable all the hardcore tracking via a cell network just because you want to connect to Bluetooth.
For phones, Pinephone is very nearly this. The only thing is that GPS and cell service are on the same switch (because they're handled by the same chip on the board)
For phones, Pinephone is very nearly this. The only thing is that GPS and cell service are on the same switch (because they're handled by the same chip on the board)
Personally I’d call that a safety issue. A few years ago my wife and I were driving a rental car that was rear ended on the highway by a drunk driver. The impact caved in the left rear wheel and spun us 360 degrees across 3 lanes of the highway. Within a few seconds of coming to a stop an OnStar person was talking to us, asking if we were ok and confirming our location.
We had no clue ahead of time that the rental car had one of these services, but at that moment we were very happy it did. I honestly have no idea about the privacy ramifications, etc. but having been through that experience I’d think long and hard about disabling it outright. I do take my privacy seriously, but I’d have to weigh that against the safety of me & my family in that kind of situation and disable it only as an absolutely last resort… Just my own personal $0.02 on the matter.
I think my car only came with a free trial for that service, I think you needed to pay after a certain amount of time. Cell phone works well enough for me.
I estimate that the probability of injuring my arms and that no one else is around to call for help is low enough to not be worth the monthly subscription.
It's incredibly unlikely that you'd be in such a bad accident that you couldn't call for help; while simultaneously being isolated from the public to the point nobody saw your accident and started calling ems/police before you could.
That's not to say it doesn't happen; but I definitely wouldn't be worried about it.
You obviously don't live or drive in a semi-rural area at night with larger wildlife that tends to dart across the road in front of cars. All it takes is hitting a deer or javelina hard and going into a ditch.
Playing devil's advocate, in a crazy accident you may not be able to get to/reach your phone, or even be responsive. If you use the personal assistant function on your phone, it's no different than using OnStar, in terms of privacy.
All of this said, last I heard OnStar was pretty expensive for the average household income. I don't have it, and I don't worry too much about it.
That depends a lot on where you drive. I've been in situations where, if I had hit a moose, there would have been no one around to call for help except the moose (assuming it had survived the collision, but they often do if it's a smaller vehicle). That stretch of road didn't get many passers-by on snowy Sunday nights in January. Maybe a half-dozen vehicles an hour. Combine that with poor visibility, and it could have been a long time before someone noticed and called for help. Fortunately, I never did have an accident along that stretch.
Of course, if you're only driving in built-up areas or along major transit corridors instead of in awkward parts of northern Ontario in the middle of winter, your chances of having someone call in for you are much higher.
I think OnStar is satellite-based, so it might reach areas where cell service doesn't. I believe the stretch of highway I was thinking of (Ontario highway 655) does have at least partial cell coverage now, although it didn't at the time when I was driving it regularly. It isn't extremely remote—it would take emergency services from Cochrane or Timmins about half an hour to reach the farthest point, so they might get there in time, depending on what exactly the damage was.
How dare they have an election system that lets them elect politicians that are actually doing what the people want instead of having to choose between bad and worse! It must be some forbidden knowledge for sure.
Don't get your idealism in a frenzy. The EU has been passing some interesting privacy laws recently, but politics is politics and the EU isn't immune to lobbying, corruption and incompetence.
