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SplashJackson ,

Fuckin finally, I been waiting years to play Quest 64 in HD!

MonkderDritte ,

Higher FPS? Classical Ninendo games don't use FPS as timer?

Lifter ,

I don't think n64 did. They even had major frame drops in many games.

Mr_Dr_Oink ,

I thought there were many aspects of the games directly tied to fram rate.

I know that, at least in the case of mario 64, Speed runners abuse game mechanics tied to frame rate to perform tricks such as backwards long jump and other door hacks. Marios eyes blinking are tied to frame rate, they used this to identify faked speed runs in some cases.

I imagine there must be other things aswell.

Piemanding ,

Yes. I know Zelda Ocarina of Time has many things, including walking speed, tied to framerate because of ZFG. Also, the 3DS remake reused a lot of the code and several things tied to framerate got quicker because it ran at 30 fps instead of 20. Items despawn quicker because they despawn at a set amount of frames.

tabular ,
@tabular@lemmy.world avatar

Perhaps they add code to split physics and grsphical fps.

hasnt_seen_goonies ,

This is what they do in the manual decompile projects (like is happening for Majora's mask now), but this tool can only preserve logic.

VindictiveJudge ,
@VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world avatar

According to the video, game logic is still opperating at 20hz and the GPU uses frame interpolation to tripple the FPS.

MonkderDritte ,

Thanks! Didn't saw the video.

owlboy ,
@owlboy@lemmy.world avatar

Damn. Thats impressive.

Potatos_are_not_friends ,

Seriously! To push through in spite of Nintendo's reputation.

werefreeatlast ,

Nintendo is preparing to sue the proper technologies out of existence. Anyway, what did you say the researchers last names were? First names too if you got them. Nintendo would love an address and possible information on their whereabouts around lunch time. It's all for the benefit of all players out there!

ICastFist ,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

Ok, any info on how that's being done? It sure sounds like Wiseguy figured how to compile the code that was meant for the specific VR4300 (RISC) N64's CPU for typical x86-64 architecture

bruhduh ,
@bruhduh@lemmy.world avatar

Apple Rosetta 2 technically recompiles code from x86 to arm too in jit and sometimes aot, also there's box86/64 open source project, only difference between example I've said and OP is recompilation actually saves all results and not just cache, another difficulty is in OS difference, he needs not just binary translate but have something akin to WINE too while he recompiles code

ICastFist ,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

If he's compiling from windows to windows, target OS shouldn't be a problem. Also, I just had to go one extra click to read Mr-Wiseguy's github 😅

He could also, in theory, use Cosmopolitan to generate an APE (Actually Portable Executable) that will run on linux, bsd, windows and mac. I had to find a video where Justine talks about it to understand how and why it works: it's basically a trick to rewrite the header of the executable, with the real magic being an "optional shebang" that lets both Windows and *Nix run the first bytes.

bruhduh ,
@bruhduh@lemmy.world avatar

Thanks for detailed reply, i understood everything except i don't understand how cosmopolitan filters syscalls because deferent OS have different syscalls, otherwise there wouldn't be need for WINE

ICastFist ,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

She starts explaining APE at around 14:30. The executable is a "Windows MZ executable" that runs everywhere else, including off BIOS. Before that, she shows her redbean http server, which uses this tech.

https://invidious.baczek.me/watch?v=1ZTRb-2DZGs -- original YT link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZTRb-2DZGs

FiniteBanjo ,

When I saw this post yesterday I just thought "Ha, suck it dumb corporations who don't know how to make their own IP work."

But now that I'm seeing it again I just had the realization "HOL UP, raytracing? N64 Raytracing?"

refalo ,

this was always possible, not sure why people are just now freaking out about it.

I remember someone doing the same thing with NES back in 2013: https://andrewkelley.me/post/jamulator.html

Kolanaki ,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

It was always possible with tons and tons of work; the news is that some dude made a tool that makes it a piece of cake to recompile the games directly from a ROM.

refalo ,

I wonder how much talent is wasted because of jaded programmers that think it's dumb (to them) to make something simple even if it would become very popular and maybe profitable

Socsa ,

This is very similar to something we did in engineering school in like 2008. For a reconfigurable computing project we translated machine code into HDL.

This is something you could have done for a while if you had a few million dollars to pay a team of computer engineers to do it. The new part is the classic "some dude figured out an efficient way to do it in his garage over the summer."

refalo ,

can be done as a school project

needs a few million dollars

which is it?

absentbird , (edited )
@absentbird@lemm.ee avatar

Yes

The cost of hiring a team of programmers the size of a large class can easily cost millions of dollars. There's a long history of school projects accomplishing things in computer science that would have cost millions. Look at BSD for example.

refalo ,

unironically all you really need is one or two neurospicy individuals that are passionate about your project and just about anything can be done in a matter of weeks.

absentbird ,
@absentbird@lemm.ee avatar

You could say that about basically anything: it only takes one or two passionate people to [write a great novel, build a house, invent something new, prove a scientific theory, advance the field of mathematics] in a matter of weeks.

Those are rare and impressive exceptions, it's not so simple in practice. The Mythical Man Month has some good insight on this. Big projects cost big money, and don't necessarily get the job done faster.

cyrus ,
@cyrus@sopuli.xyz avatar

Just so you know, the actual source code for this project mentions both Jamulator and another project that did this for the N64.

mesamunefire , (edited )

Has anyone been able to get this working? I was able to compile it for zelda but nothing else.
https://github.com/Mr-Wiseguy/N64Recomp

Not sure how to get the elf files, heres an issue: https://github.com/Mr-Wiseguy/N64Recomp/issues/21

This is how far people have gotten: https://github.com/Mr-Wiseguy/N64Recomp/issues/17

SatansMaggotyCumFart ,

Nice try Nintendo lawyer.

Mighty ,
@Mighty@lemmy.world avatar

so. For dumb people like me (or just for me to be clear), how do I play those games? i watched the video and read the site. there's a link to the MM gamefiles on GitHub, but the video said you still need the ROMs? or this RT64?
I'm old and apparently at some point, you just lose tech savvyness... :(
can I get a step-by-step?

Johanno ,

Ok I answer her without watching the video or any knowledge:

I assume you need to download the github project and compile it yourself (except there are releases on the right side)

You should follow the readme in the project.

There should be an information about where you should put the roms.

The roms can be (legally) download on different websites. It's legal for archive reasons (afaik).

billiam0202 ,

From what I could see, the releases are specifically for Majora's Mask, and not the tool used to recompile N64 games in general.

Psythik ,

Yes you still need the ROMs since these PC ports contain no copywritten code. Like the other person said, you will need to compile the game yourself, but there are tools that automate the process. It's simply a matter of getting all the files you need in one place, and clicking a few buttons. The hard part is obtaining all the files (well, more tedious than hard, especially if you're not a programmer or a Linux user).

MisterFrog ,
@MisterFrog@lemmy.world avatar

Am I the only one who watched the video, and due to nostalgia upscaling my memory, could hardly tell any difference other than frame rate.

I should go look at the normal game 😅

You999 ,

Would the recompiled games effect how ACE works in some games? I'd assume since the machine code is different the exploits used to trick the pointers would be different.

BradleyUffner ,

Most likely. The documentation says it can change what was a single instruction on the N64 into multiple instructions, so those values will potentially be very different. It will probably close off some exploits, change others, and even introduce new ones.

catnip ,

100%

HEXN3T ,
@HEXN3T@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Fuck it, F-ZERO X at 240 FPS. Why not?

buzz86us ,

Damn perfect dark would be amazing with online play it was such a good game, and Microsoft pretty much killed it on Xbox

SeaJ OP ,

It would also be great at something above 20 fps.

Petter1 ,

I need 60fps upscaled Pokémon Stadion with raytracing now 😌where?

whotookkarl ,
@whotookkarl@lemmy.world avatar

Didn't read the article, did Nintendo pay to develop this to be able to preserve the games history and release them for free so they can get some new fans for these retro games and IPs to maybe encourage them to buy some newer released games in the same series?

lazynooblet ,
@lazynooblet@lazysoci.al avatar

The was a long sentence. I imagined you gasping for breath at the end.

whotookkarl ,
@whotookkarl@lemmy.world avatar

Maybe it was written that way to make you read faster as you get toward the end to convey a sense of facetiousness because I didn't need to read the article to know none of that's true, who knows. I'm probably just spending too much time online lately.

I_Clean_Here ,

Maybe read the article to find out.

bamboo ,

Exactly, with Nintendo's existing IP and old gamers dying, they need a way to get younger generation exposed to what kids in the 80s and 90s grew up with and make sure that it's plastered on all the streaming websites to get maximum exposure.

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